DEAN BECKER: The failure of Drug War is glaringly obvious to judges, cops, wardens, prosecutors and millions more. Now calling for decriminalization, legalization, the end of prohibition. Let us investigate the Century of Lies.
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DEAN BECKER: The book written by a gentleman writes “How I Convinced the U.S. Government To Provide My Marijuana and Helped Launch a National Movement.” The book, “My Medicine” and I’ll let him tell you all about it. Want to welcome, Mr. Irvin Rosenfeld. Hey Irv, how are you doing?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Alright, Dean, thank you very much for this opportunity.
DEAN BECKER: Irv, I was telling the folks here at the station here before the show about you and, despite all your efforts, I don’t think any of them knew about you…the situation – what this medicine has done for you. Why don’t you tell them a little bit about your history?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: The federal government has done a good job of sheltering us from people knowing about us. But, yes, I am one of four people in the United States that receives medical cannabis (medical marijuana) from the United States federal government that they grow on the campus of the University of Mississippi. They ship to Raleigh, North Carolina [inaudible] 300 cigarettes and it’s shipped to my pharmacy here in Miami where I pick it up.
I have a severe bone disorder. I discovered it at age 10 in 1963. I discovered medical cannabis in 1971. I started taking on the federal government to provide it for me in 1972 and in 1982, ten years later, I won. I became the second person in the United States to receive medical cannabis.
It got up to 13 patients in 1992 when George Bush, Sr. shut the program down. We were grandfathered in. And today I’m afraid to say that there are only 4 of us left.
DEAN BECKER: Irv, this brings to mind…you say they’ve tried to keep that information from wide dissemination. They don’t want folks to know about you because the truth of the matter is that the Drug Czar and many of these official “mucky-mucks” in government go around saying there is no legitimate medical use for marijuana when the truth is slapping them right in the forehead, isn’t it?! There is, indeed, a legitimate use.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: There definitely is a legitimate use. The four of us federal patients have done fantastic on the use of cannabis. I, myself, used to take opiates. I haven’t taken an opiate since 1990 because of medical cannabis. A glaucoma patient, a MS patient, a Nail-patella syndrome patient – we’re all doing fantastic.
And the federal government has never once studied us - which is sad. They say, “We don’t know enough about it. We need more studies.” Well the fact is they’ve been giving it to me – it’ll be 29 years November 20th – and they’ve never studied us.
We had to do a private study that was done in 2001 in Montana and it showed the four of us patients were perfectly normal. Everything was fine. The cannabis for us has been a needed medicine. It’s worked great and the federal government doesn’t want to recognize that it’s true.
DEAN BECKER: They just fail to see it. Justice truly got the blindfold on there, huh?!
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Well, I’m not sure if it’s justice has got the blindfold or that money has blindfolded them for us. The pharmaceutical industry, the petrochemical industry, the lumber industry, the prison industry – none of those want to see a change.
That’s the sad part about it. 80% of the United States population is in favor of medical cannabis. That means there’s 20% against us. Now if it became legal tomorrow – what does the 80% gain monetarily? Nothing. But the 20% have everything to lose because they’re the ones making money off the prohibition of cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: And it is important to tie in the fact there that as miraculous as the cannabis plant is for medicinal purposes – there are thousands of uses for the hemp plant for industry and on down the line. They’re all lumped into the same category. Some say it’s because of the possibilities with hemp more so than the benefit from the cannabis or the “high” side of it all.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: That’s very true. Again, it works hand in hand. If medical cannabis became available tomorrow – hemp would be next. If hemp became available tomorrow – medical cannabis would be next. Therefore, industries that would lose because of one of them becoming legal are against us.
DEAN BECKER: You say 29 years here in just about a month.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yeah, and when you think about it – that’s amazing. How many of your listeners out there are thinking – whether they’re 50-years-old, 60-years-old – to think for almost half my life they’ve been sending me medical cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: I understand that for a while there the quality was not that good but they’ve actually improved the quality of it. Is that true?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Well, they’ve improved the content as far as it’s not as dirty with seeds and stems. As far as the quality – the quality has stayed about the same. But, again, it works and that’s what counts.
You know, I like to say that if the government recognized that cannabis is a medicine that actually worked then maybe they’d look into different strains and find which strains work better for me than for glaucoma, whatever. But they don’t.
But at least, thank God, I get it and it does work for me and that’s what counts.
I have bone tumors on the end of long bones - approximately 200 of them throughout my body. The disorder says that these tumors should grow at any time and I should develop new ones at any time. I have not had a new tumor develop nor an existing one grow for 37 years – since I was 21-years-old.
Now the doctors have no idea why. Well, gee, they’ve done studies that say cannabis has delineated fleshy tumors, has lowered tumors in cancer and things like that. Well maybe its kept my bone tumors from growing. That’s the only reason I can understand.
DEAN BECKER: And, Irv, what irks me, motivates me as well, is that the potential, the possibilities for realizing gain, for benefiting man-kind can still occur. But it irks me that the federal government prevents those studies from being done…for those positives from being developed. Your response, sir.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: It irks me too because I’m living proof of how well it works. That’s the sad part about it. That’s why we do what we do because we know that we’re right. We know we’re right. This herb could…
We’ve got natural cannabinoid receptors all throughout our body – endocannabinoid system through our body. People have heard of endorphins. Everybody’s heard of endorphins, “Oh yeah, natural morphine receptors that produce, like, morphine but it’s natural to the body.”
And I go, “Yeah. But what they’ve discovered is the endocannabinoid system is what does that.”
So we have this natural system in our body and we need the medicine but we’re not getting it. We’re not getting this nutrient that we need in our body. It’s been taken away from us for 77 years. That’s why we’re getting all the different diseases that we weren’t getting 77 years ago - like autism in kids and different disorders like that - because we’re deprived of the cannabis that our system really needs.
And we know that. It’s been discovered 15 years ago. So people understand that this is a needed substance for us - not only medicine for people who are sick but also a substance for people who are healthy. Because all us of this really is medical use.
DEAN BECKER: We hear the term, “reefer madness”, and I want to play a track here. I want to share this with you. It’s produced by some folks with ABC.
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JOHN GREGORY: …or trick. A warning for parents this Halloween. Your kids candy could be laced with marijuana. Welcome back to Eyewitness News at 11:30. I’m John Gregory for Phil Palmer.
LESLIE SYKES: And I’m Leslie Sykes. Gummy bear, Mars bars and marijuana? Well, it could happen and that’s why the L.A. County Sheriff’s department is warning parents to take a close look at winds up in your “trick or treater’s” bag.
Eyewitness news reporter, Melissa MacBride, is live at sheriff’s headquarters in Monterey Park with what parents need to look out for.
MELISSA MacBRIDE: Good Morning. The L.A. County Sheriff’s department wants to raise awareness about the types of items sold at marijuana dispensaries – specifically the ones that you can eat – so they don’t end up in the wrong hands this Halloween.
They look like regular cookies, crackers and candy but they’re the last treats you’d want your kids to eat. One of the main ingredients is marijuana and, in some cases, a lot of it.
DEPUTY SHERIFF: This contains THC. This is potentially dangerous to any child that is ingesting this. We have no idea how much THC this contains. We have no idea of the potency.
MELISSA MacBRIDE: Some of these edibles are labeled, “Keep out of reach of children and pets.” They list cannabis in the list of ingredients and they do say “For medical use only.” But you have to read the fine print.
The L.A. County Sheriff’s department says it’s not aware of anyone handing out marijuana-laced munchies on Halloween in the past but they want people of all ages to know the THC-containing treats are out there in many forms – including trail mix and drinks that could be served at a party.
DEPUTY SHERIFF: Some of the concentrated cannabis that we’re dealing with does not have an odor to it. But when we start getting into the food products – it definitely still has an odor. It doesn’t smell like straight, um, “bud” but it has an odor to it consistent with marijuana – that “skunk” smell.
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DEAN BECKER: Irv, I don’t know anybody that gives away marijuana – especially to kids. Your response to that, please.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: No, I’m afraid I don’t either. That just doesn’t happen. We’re very responsible people using medical cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: It’s just so absurd that they say there’s been no reported instances in the past but everybody needs to be alert.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Exactly. God forbid that somebody should do that. You explain to the kids what it is and they’re not dumb.
DEAN BECKER: Tell them a little bit about your career, Irv.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I have been a stockbroker with a brokerage firm here in Ft. Lauderdale for 24 years. I handle a lot of money on a daily basis. I get no high off the cannabis.
But also, besides that, which is, you know, it’s nice making people money – which is good. But it’s important that what I do every Saturday is teach mentally and physically challenged children and adults how to sail adaptive sail boats in an organization called Shake-a-Leg in Miami.
We have adaptive sail boats. We have chair lifts in the boats. We’ve got a paraplegic, quadriplegic, whatever type of disability – Muscular Dystrophy, Multiple Sclerosis – whatever. I do that every Saturday when I’m in town. I’m able to do that because I have the right medicine.
Now, when I take adult groups out I take my medicine on board and I smoke. When I take out children’s groups – I don’t. I wouldn’t subject them to that. The point is I’m able to this because I have the right medicine.
Another group we take out is “Wounded Warriors”. The VA, the Veterans Administration, has come out stating that…this was almost a year ago that Patients Out of Time, my organization, got them to come out this way. Stating that if your state has a medical marijuana law and you’re a veteran – say from Afghanistan that’s got a leg shot off – and you’re taking opiates for your pain and you’re also taking cannabis for your PTSD – if you test positive the VA is not going to do anything to you if you’re in one-third of the country that allows medical cannabis.
But, if you’re in Florida, if you’re in Texas, in Virginia where I’m from, and God forbid you test positive for the metabolites of cannabis then the VA would withhold your opiates. So what I want people to start doing is to try to change the laws in those states. Say to your representatives, “Why are you against veterans?”
Politicians say, “Wait a minute. I’m not against veterans.” And you say, “Yes you are because in the state of Texas if a veteran tests positive for cannabis, you’re going to take away his opiates. But in 1/3 of the country – they’re not. So, again, Mr. Politician – why are you against our veterans?”
DEAN BECKER: Irv, I want to come back to your book for a moment to talk about the beginnings - how you first learned about the medicinal properties, how it was a benefit to you.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I was an advocate in the late 60s and early 70s against marijuana (which is what I knew it as) because when I saw a healthy person using an illegal drug and here I was having to take all these narcotics from the surgeries I was having.
I went to college in Miami in 1971. In my apartment complex, we’re all college students, and we’d be outside and we’d be swimming in south Florida and they’d say, “Let’s go drink some wine and smoke some pot.” Which I wouldn’t do. After 30 days I realized I wasn’t making friends so I gave into peer pressure and tried it.
It wasn’t harming these kids and nothing happened to me. I didn’t get high. It didn’t harm me. So now I was accepted and I did it. About the tenth time I did it, I was playing a game of chess and I sat for 30 minutes. It was the first time in 5 years that I had sat for longer than 10 minutes. So immediately I thought what narcotics I had taken. I had morphine, I had Quaaludes, I had valium – you know the main drugs back in 1971 – legally and it dawned on me that I hadn’t taken a pill for 6 hours.
Then why could I sit for the first time in 5 years?! And just then they handed me the joint. I looked at this piece of garbage – because to me that’s all it was – and I thought was there any medical benefit to this garbage.
I contacted my family. My great-uncle was one of the heads of pediatrics at Johns Hopkins, another uncle taught pediatrics at Yale, my sister was head of Nuclear Medicine at Duke, my Ona was a surgeon at Ports of Virginia…I contacted. And lo and behold we researched and found that cannabis had been used a medicine in this country legally from 1860 until 1937.
It was manufactured by Merck, Eli-Lily - all the major pharmaceutical companies - used for many disorders but prevalently for muscle relaxant, anti-inflammatory and for pain. And I go, “Well, Ah – that’s what it’s doing for me.”
And it wasn’t outlawed in this country because of its non-medical value – it was outlawed because of political and monetary value. Once I discovered that it was a medicine – I had to have it legal. So that’s when I started taking on the federal government – in 1972. Thank God, with the help of a lot of people, including the University of Virginia Law School, and the state of Virginia – I was able to take on the federal government and finally in 1982 I won.
Now the federal government does a very good job of scaring people about medical cannabis and not getting the word out about us few federal patients. I’ve done what I can and like you do with these shows and other people. We get the word out but I would say if there’s 307 million people in this country – I would dare say there aren’t more than10 million people who know about me.
And that’s what’s so sad. Because these people have never…the doctors that are against us, or the politicians that are against us, the police that are against us – they don’t have any medical degrees. They don’t know what they are talking about. All this is rhetoric that the federal government has said…that it causes brain damage, that it causes lung damage, that it causes this and causes that.
What I like to say to people is, “Gee, if that’s really true – explain me!” Before we had a study done the people against us would say about me, “Well, Irvin, you’re the 85-year-old man who smokes three packs of cigarettes a day and says, ‘What do you mean it causes lung cancer? I don’t have it. I’m an anomaly.’”
After the four of us had the testing done. Now when they say, “You’re the only four people in the country that it doesn’t harm but anybody else it would harm.”
But I want to drive under my federal protocol as long as I don’t get an intoxication effect – which I don’t. Now the difference is that people who are cannabis knowledgeable – who get high – they don’t purposely get high and want to drive. They do not. They’re responsible people.
Now if, God forbid, they go somewhere and normally they would smoke half a joint and not get that high and they could drive…all of the sudden they smoke something that gets them really high and they’ve got to drive. Well, guess what? These people all of the sudden realize, “Well, darn, I’m really high. I didn’t want to get that high but I’ve got to drive home.”
Now they know they’re high. That’s a big difference. So when they’re driving they know they have a high. It’s likely they’re going to drive more cautiously and slower. Unlike the person who drinks alcohol and goes, “What do you mean there’s something wrong with me?! I’m fine. I can drive.”
DEAN BECKER: “I’ll fight you for my keys. Give ‘em here!”
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Exactly and that’s what they do. Where the person who’s high on cannabis goes, “Shit, I didn’t mean to get high. Oh my God and I got to drive home. This is not good. But I’ll do it. But I know I’m high.”
That’s the difference. People are more cautious.
DEAN BECKER: I was going to bring up this. The legal marijuana extract that sold- I think it’s made by Merck or Phizer – and it’s a Schedule III which can be prescribed. It’s more readily prescribed these days than ever before. It’s called Marinol – the synthetic THC and they have a warning on the label that says, “Use appropriately until you adjust to its effects.” Be careful with driving or whatever until you get used to the effects.
I think, perhaps, the same could be said of use of any cannabis product.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: First of all it’s by UniMed and is a Schedule III drug. Just like any medicine that we get there’s a label to be careful of about dangerous machinery until you understand the effects of this drug. And that should be with any medicine, including cannabis.
What I laugh about, not laugh, it’s kind of sad is all these commercials we see on TV about all these different drugs that are prescribed and approved by the FDA….every one of them says they can kill you…or it can do this or do that. I mean EVERY one of them. But yet the FDA approved this drug for this use. Even Viagra – if you get an erection for four hours, Oh my God…you know…it’s ridiculous. FDA approves for use but yet it can kill you.
And no one has ever died off cannabis. No one! There’s no lung cancers. If anything it’s an inhibitor against cancer.
DEAN BECKER: The “powers that be” remain near as firmly entrenched as ever, unwilling to debate this issue. And I think there lies the solution – having that final, open debate. Your response.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I would love to get on a podium with my opposition but they will not do it. So that’s a sad aspect. You know, you talk about the detrimental side effects of it and I’d love for them to understand that here I am, a real patient, that I’ve been getting the medicine for 29 years and get to know me.
If you get to know me you’re going to see the fallacies that you believe aren’t true. I’m a very respectful member of society. The sad part of it is how many people in this country are sitting at home because they don’t have the right medicine and they’re not productive members of society. In fact, they’re a drain on society.
Look at the health care issue. We talk about, God forbid, what’s going to happen with health care issues, etc. You know something? Elderly patients could grow this and they would be able to substitute different drugs and use cannabis instead. They wouldn’t have to worry about the interaction of drugs and everything.
So it’s really sad that our country is so paranoid from the pharmaceutical industry and everything else that they won’t even look at this as a potential savior for our medical system and for our patients and also for our economic system.
To put people to work to grow this would be amazing. We’re able to import hemp from Slovakia, Russia, China but we can’t grow it in this country. That doesn’t make any sense to me. We can control pharmaceuticals in this country – we can control this.
The point is even if people are allowed to grow their own – is that the worst thing?! That people are allowed to grow their own medicines instead of spending money on pharmaceuticals?
What always gets me is when people are very sick and they talk about medical cannabis and our opposition says, “Man, it can make you euphoric!” Wait a minute! If you’re sick and you’re not feeling well and you take something that makes you feel better and you feel a little happy – what’s wrong with that?! I just can’t understand that.
Something to our opposition that I always try to state…you know something? Cancer and different diseases, Chrons and different diseases, glaucoma…they don’t know if you’re Republican or Democrat.
Republicans, of all people, talk about states’ rights…states’ rights, states’ rights…except when it comes to drugs - then it’s federal rights. I’m very happy being a federal patient. I don’t have to worry about states’ rights, however, I truly believe that if the feds aren’t going to do anything about it…they had opportunities.
In 1988, Francis Young’s hearings for two years that the DEA had to hold. And Francis Young, a DEA judge, said it is “one of the most benign substances known to mankind and should be made Schedule II or III.” And they ignored him.
The Institute of Medicine report of 1999 which, again, said that medical cannabis should be used until other avenues come up as far as smoking. But smoking for the short term until better comes up. Again, smoking…it can be vaporized, you can make edibles, you can make tinctures – you don’t have to smoke it.
But smoking to me…I’ve been smoking for 40 years and my lungs are perfectly normal. When people talk about it causing lung cancer. Well, gee, Dr. Donald Paskin, the government doctor did a ten year study and at the end of ten years he said he could not find one case of lung cancer due to cannabis.
In fact he said the people who smoked cigarettes and cannabis had less cancer than people who just smoked cigarettes but he wasn’t sure why.
DEAN BECKER: You were talking about states’ rights and I want to bring this up. I think it was last week, perhaps the week before, Senator James Webb had put forward an idea to the senate that let’s investigate the criminal justice system – find the aberrations, fix it up, make it work better for everyone, cut down on the number of prisoners and the number being sent back.
I think it has been rejected. I hear word that perhaps they’re looking at it again. But the objections were all based on, “Oh no, the federal government can’t get involved with that – that’s a states’ rights issue.” And yet, as you were saying, they don’t mind that the federal government deals with the state laws about cannabis.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Very true. James Webb, I think, is from Virginia.
DEAN BECKER: I believe that’s right, yes.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Virginia – the history of our country, “Give me liberty or give me death.” – Patrick Henry. That’s how I was able to take on the federal government when I was in Virginia and I had the state of Virginia behind me.
DEAN BECKER: What a wonderful thing.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: It was then but yet even Virginia today is as backward as a lot of other states. They’ve tried to bring up medical cannabis laws and it’s not gotten anywhere. Although, I want to brag a little bit, I got a law passed in Virginia in 1979. I got Governor Dalton to sign the law and it’s still in effect in Virginia today. It says that a doctor can prescribe (it says prescribe, not recommend) medical marijuana for pain due to cancer and glaucoma.
I was the only patient in Virginia, to my knowledge, that’s ever used it. At that point if I went to the black market – it was a gray area but I wasn’t breaking Virginia law.
DEAN BECKER: That’s amazing.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: That was 1979 and would have ever thought that all these years later we’re still fighting the same issue.
DEAN BECKER: You mentioned 29 years next month that the government has been sending this to you. And, again, it’s grown at the University of Mississippi, approved by the FDA, stamped and certified by the DEA and, as you say, delivered by FedEx, right?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Correct. Grown by NIDA, the National Institute of Drug Abuse, they grow and ship it. And, yeah, approved by FDA, DEA and FedEx ships it.
DEAN BECKER: Oh, 29 years, this also brings to mind…300 joints, about a gram per joint every 29 days – how many pounds has the federal government sent you?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I figured it out at one time – over 200 pounds.
DEAN BECKER: That’s a lot. That’s a bunch.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yeah, and thank your listeners because your tax money pays for it. I appreciate it.
DEAN BECKER: Alright. Irvin we got just a couple minutes left here and I wanted to hand it over to you and let’s talk, once again, about Patients Out of Time and how folks can learn more and perhaps get involved…perhaps come to the conference next year, right?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yes, the conference is April 26-28t h in Tucson, Arizona. We are the medical organization in the United States, in the world for that matter. We are the only ones sanctioned by the American Medical Association, the American Nurses Association to teach doctors and nurses about medical cannabis.
We will have this conference and have the top scientists, doctors, nurses, patients and we want everyone to come out there to learn about medical cannabis. But, more important, to be able to see for themselves the legitimacy of this medicine. That when the federal government states that it’s not a medicine, it’s not real, and we have the top scientist…we have scientists that one day will win the Nobel Medical Prize because what they have discovered as far as the endocannabinoid system that is throughout every person, every animal. We need cannabis in our system. That’s what they’ve discovered. That’s what they’ve learned.
You know people talk about endorphins and they learn about that. But, you know, when people first heard about that – they didn’t know about it either. Medical schools didn’t teach this so it took time and they finally started teaching it and the now the average individual knows about it. Well, guess what? The endorphin system is through the endocannabinoid system.
So we discovered this. For 15 years we know that. We’re teaching it to our doctors, to our nurses. Medical schools aren’t teaching it yet. They will be but we’re ahead of the curve. We’re trying to say, “Come out. Learn about it. Go to our website.” Doctors and nurses can download our previous conferences and get continuing education credits today – it’s there: http://medicalcannabis.com.
Do that. Learn about it and you’ll be in the forefront of modern medicine.
DEAN BECKER: Alright. Irvin Rosenfeld, thank you so much. We’ll be talking to you soon.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Alright, you take care.
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[music]
DEAN BECKER: To dream…the American dream.
To lie still and hope…with both of your eyes closed.
To ignore…the nightmare that surrounds you.
Just to try…try to reach the American dream.
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[Music intro]
STEWIE GRIFFIN: [Singing] Now everybody gather round and listen if you would, when I tell you every person needs a way of feeling good. Every kitten needs a ball of string and every dog a stick, but all you need is a bag of weed to really get a kick!
CROWD: One two three four five six seven eight! A bag of weed, a bag of weed, everything's better with a bag of weed. It's the only help that you'll ever need, because everything is better with a bag of weed!
STEWIE GRIFFIN: There you go; you're all getting it now!
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DEAN BECKER: It’s an honor. It’s a privilege. It’s a joy. This is the best job I’ve ever had in my life. Thank you for letting me do this. Please show your support for what I do.
There’s no reason for this Drug War to exist. Prohibido istac evilesco!
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For the Drug Truth Network, this is Dean Becker asking you to examine our policy of Drug Prohibition.
The Century of Lies.
This show produced at Pacifica Studios at KPFT, Houston.
Transcript
Transcript
Century of Lies / October 30, 2011
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DEAN BECKER: The failure of Drug War is glaringly obvious to judges, cops, wardens, prosecutors and millions more. Now calling for decriminalization, legalization, the end of prohibition. Let us investigate the Century of Lies.
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DEAN BECKER: The book written by a gentleman writes “How I Convinced the U.S. Government To Provide My Marijuana and Helped Launch a National Movement.” The book, “My Medicine” and I’ll let him tell you all about it. Want to welcome, Mr. Irvin Rosenfeld. Hey Irv, how are you doing?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Alright, Dean, thank you very much for this opportunity.
DEAN BECKER: Irv, I was telling the folks here at the station here before the show about you and, despite all your efforts, I don’t think any of them knew about you…the situation – what this medicine has done for you. Why don’t you tell them a little bit about your history?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: The federal government has done a good job of sheltering us from people knowing about us. But, yes, I am one of four people in the United States that receives medical cannabis (medical marijuana) from the United States federal government that they grow on the campus of the University of Mississippi. They ship to Raleigh, North Carolina [inaudible] 300 cigarettes and it’s shipped to my pharmacy here in Miami where I pick it up.
I have a severe bone disorder. I discovered it at age 10 in 1963. I discovered medical cannabis in 1971. I started taking on the federal government to provide it for me in 1972 and in 1982, ten years later, I won. I became the second person in the United States to receive medical cannabis.
It got up to 13 patients in 1992 when George Bush, Sr. shut the program down. We were grandfathered in. And today I’m afraid to say that there are only 4 of us left.
DEAN BECKER: Irv, this brings to mind…you say they’ve tried to keep that information from wide dissemination. They don’t want folks to know about you because the truth of the matter is that the Drug Czar and many of these official “mucky-mucks” in government go around saying there is no legitimate medical use for marijuana when the truth is slapping them right in the forehead, isn’t it?! There is, indeed, a legitimate use.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: There definitely is a legitimate use. The four of us federal patients have done fantastic on the use of cannabis. I, myself, used to take opiates. I haven’t taken an opiate since 1990 because of medical cannabis. A glaucoma patient, a MS patient, a Nail-patella syndrome patient – we’re all doing fantastic.
And the federal government has never once studied us - which is sad. They say, “We don’t know enough about it. We need more studies.” Well the fact is they’ve been giving it to me – it’ll be 29 years November 20th – and they’ve never studied us.
We had to do a private study that was done in 2001 in Montana and it showed the four of us patients were perfectly normal. Everything was fine. The cannabis for us has been a needed medicine. It’s worked great and the federal government doesn’t want to recognize that it’s true.
DEAN BECKER: They just fail to see it. Justice truly got the blindfold on there, huh?!
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Well, I’m not sure if it’s justice has got the blindfold or that money has blindfolded them for us. The pharmaceutical industry, the petrochemical industry, the lumber industry, the prison industry – none of those want to see a change.
That’s the sad part about it. 80% of the United States population is in favor of medical cannabis. That means there’s 20% against us. Now if it became legal tomorrow – what does the 80% gain monetarily? Nothing. But the 20% have everything to lose because they’re the ones making money off the prohibition of cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: And it is important to tie in the fact there that as miraculous as the cannabis plant is for medicinal purposes – there are thousands of uses for the hemp plant for industry and on down the line. They’re all lumped into the same category. Some say it’s because of the possibilities with hemp more so than the benefit from the cannabis or the “high” side of it all.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: That’s very true. Again, it works hand in hand. If medical cannabis became available tomorrow – hemp would be next. If hemp became available tomorrow – medical cannabis would be next. Therefore, industries that would lose because of one of them becoming legal are against us.
DEAN BECKER: You say 29 years here in just about a month.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yeah, and when you think about it – that’s amazing. How many of your listeners out there are thinking – whether they’re 50-years-old, 60-years-old – to think for almost half my life they’ve been sending me medical cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: I understand that for a while there the quality was not that good but they’ve actually improved the quality of it. Is that true?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Well, they’ve improved the content as far as it’s not as dirty with seeds and stems. As far as the quality – the quality has stayed about the same. But, again, it works and that’s what counts.
You know, I like to say that if the government recognized that cannabis is a medicine that actually worked then maybe they’d look into different strains and find which strains work better for me than for glaucoma, whatever. But they don’t.
But at least, thank God, I get it and it does work for me and that’s what counts.
I have bone tumors on the end of long bones - approximately 200 of them throughout my body. The disorder says that these tumors should grow at any time and I should develop new ones at any time. I have not had a new tumor develop nor an existing one grow for 37 years – since I was 21-years-old.
Now the doctors have no idea why. Well, gee, they’ve done studies that say cannabis has delineated fleshy tumors, has lowered tumors in cancer and things like that. Well maybe its kept my bone tumors from growing. That’s the only reason I can understand.
DEAN BECKER: And, Irv, what irks me, motivates me as well, is that the potential, the possibilities for realizing gain, for benefiting man-kind can still occur. But it irks me that the federal government prevents those studies from being done…for those positives from being developed. Your response, sir.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: It irks me too because I’m living proof of how well it works. That’s the sad part about it. That’s why we do what we do because we know that we’re right. We know we’re right. This herb could…
We’ve got natural cannabinoid receptors all throughout our body – endocannabinoid system through our body. People have heard of endorphins. Everybody’s heard of endorphins, “Oh yeah, natural morphine receptors that produce, like, morphine but it’s natural to the body.”
And I go, “Yeah. But what they’ve discovered is the endocannabinoid system is what does that.”
So we have this natural system in our body and we need the medicine but we’re not getting it. We’re not getting this nutrient that we need in our body. It’s been taken away from us for 77 years. That’s why we’re getting all the different diseases that we weren’t getting 77 years ago - like autism in kids and different disorders like that - because we’re deprived of the cannabis that our system really needs.
And we know that. It’s been discovered 15 years ago. So people understand that this is a needed substance for us - not only medicine for people who are sick but also a substance for people who are healthy. Because all us of this really is medical use.
DEAN BECKER: We hear the term, “reefer madness”, and I want to play a track here. I want to share this with you. It’s produced by some folks with ABC.
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JOHN GREGORY: …or trick. A warning for parents this Halloween. Your kids candy could be laced with marijuana. Welcome back to Eyewitness News at 11:30. I’m John Gregory for Phil Palmer.
LESLIE SYKES: And I’m Leslie Sykes. Gummy bear, Mars bars and marijuana? Well, it could happen and that’s why the L.A. County Sheriff’s department is warning parents to take a close look at winds up in your “trick or treater’s” bag.
Eyewitness news reporter, Melissa MacBride, is live at sheriff’s headquarters in Monterey Park with what parents need to look out for.
MELISSA MacBRIDE: Good Morning. The L.A. County Sheriff’s department wants to raise awareness about the types of items sold at marijuana dispensaries – specifically the ones that you can eat – so they don’t end up in the wrong hands this Halloween.
They look like regular cookies, crackers and candy but they’re the last treats you’d want your kids to eat. One of the main ingredients is marijuana and, in some cases, a lot of it.
DEPUTY SHERIFF: This contains THC. This is potentially dangerous to any child that is ingesting this. We have no idea how much THC this contains. We have no idea of the potency.
MELISSA MacBRIDE: Some of these edibles are labeled, “Keep out of reach of children and pets.” They list cannabis in the list of ingredients and they do say “For medical use only.” But you have to read the fine print.
The L.A. County Sheriff’s department says it’s not aware of anyone handing out marijuana-laced munchies on Halloween in the past but they want people of all ages to know the THC-containing treats are out there in many forms – including trail mix and drinks that could be served at a party.
DEPUTY SHERIFF: Some of the concentrated cannabis that we’re dealing with does not have an odor to it. But when we start getting into the food products – it definitely still has an odor. It doesn’t smell like straight, um, “bud” but it has an odor to it consistent with marijuana – that “skunk” smell.
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DEAN BECKER: Irv, I don’t know anybody that gives away marijuana – especially to kids. Your response to that, please.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: No, I’m afraid I don’t either. That just doesn’t happen. We’re very responsible people using medical cannabis.
DEAN BECKER: It’s just so absurd that they say there’s been no reported instances in the past but everybody needs to be alert.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Exactly. God forbid that somebody should do that. You explain to the kids what it is and they’re not dumb.
DEAN BECKER: Tell them a little bit about your career, Irv.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I have been a stockbroker with a brokerage firm here in Ft. Lauderdale for 24 years. I handle a lot of money on a daily basis. I get no high off the cannabis.
But also, besides that, which is, you know, it’s nice making people money – which is good. But it’s important that what I do every Saturday is teach mentally and physically challenged children and adults how to sail adaptive sail boats in an organization called Shake-a-Leg in Miami.
We have adaptive sail boats. We have chair lifts in the boats. We’ve got a paraplegic, quadriplegic, whatever type of disability – Muscular Dystrophy, Multiple Sclerosis – whatever. I do that every Saturday when I’m in town. I’m able to do that because I have the right medicine.
Now, when I take adult groups out I take my medicine on board and I smoke. When I take out children’s groups – I don’t. I wouldn’t subject them to that. The point is I’m able to this because I have the right medicine.
Another group we take out is “Wounded Warriors”. The VA, the Veterans Administration, has come out stating that…this was almost a year ago that Patients Out of Time, my organization, got them to come out this way. Stating that if your state has a medical marijuana law and you’re a veteran – say from Afghanistan that’s got a leg shot off – and you’re taking opiates for your pain and you’re also taking cannabis for your PTSD – if you test positive the VA is not going to do anything to you if you’re in one-third of the country that allows medical cannabis.
But, if you’re in Florida, if you’re in Texas, in Virginia where I’m from, and God forbid you test positive for the metabolites of cannabis then the VA would withhold your opiates. So what I want people to start doing is to try to change the laws in those states. Say to your representatives, “Why are you against veterans?”
Politicians say, “Wait a minute. I’m not against veterans.” And you say, “Yes you are because in the state of Texas if a veteran tests positive for cannabis, you’re going to take away his opiates. But in 1/3 of the country – they’re not. So, again, Mr. Politician – why are you against our veterans?”
DEAN BECKER: Irv, I want to come back to your book for a moment to talk about the beginnings - how you first learned about the medicinal properties, how it was a benefit to you.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I was an advocate in the late 60s and early 70s against marijuana (which is what I knew it as) because when I saw a healthy person using an illegal drug and here I was having to take all these narcotics from the surgeries I was having.
I went to college in Miami in 1971. In my apartment complex, we’re all college students, and we’d be outside and we’d be swimming in south Florida and they’d say, “Let’s go drink some wine and smoke some pot.” Which I wouldn’t do. After 30 days I realized I wasn’t making friends so I gave into peer pressure and tried it.
It wasn’t harming these kids and nothing happened to me. I didn’t get high. It didn’t harm me. So now I was accepted and I did it. About the tenth time I did it, I was playing a game of chess and I sat for 30 minutes. It was the first time in 5 years that I had sat for longer than 10 minutes. So immediately I thought what narcotics I had taken. I had morphine, I had Quaaludes, I had valium – you know the main drugs back in 1971 – legally and it dawned on me that I hadn’t taken a pill for 6 hours.
Then why could I sit for the first time in 5 years?! And just then they handed me the joint. I looked at this piece of garbage – because to me that’s all it was – and I thought was there any medical benefit to this garbage.
I contacted my family. My great-uncle was one of the heads of pediatrics at Johns Hopkins, another uncle taught pediatrics at Yale, my sister was head of Nuclear Medicine at Duke, my Ona was a surgeon at Ports of Virginia…I contacted. And lo and behold we researched and found that cannabis had been used a medicine in this country legally from 1860 until 1937.
It was manufactured by Merck, Eli-Lily - all the major pharmaceutical companies - used for many disorders but prevalently for muscle relaxant, anti-inflammatory and for pain. And I go, “Well, Ah – that’s what it’s doing for me.”
And it wasn’t outlawed in this country because of its non-medical value – it was outlawed because of political and monetary value. Once I discovered that it was a medicine – I had to have it legal. So that’s when I started taking on the federal government – in 1972. Thank God, with the help of a lot of people, including the University of Virginia Law School, and the state of Virginia – I was able to take on the federal government and finally in 1982 I won.
Now the federal government does a very good job of scaring people about medical cannabis and not getting the word out about us few federal patients. I’ve done what I can and like you do with these shows and other people. We get the word out but I would say if there’s 307 million people in this country – I would dare say there aren’t more than10 million people who know about me.
And that’s what’s so sad. Because these people have never…the doctors that are against us, or the politicians that are against us, the police that are against us – they don’t have any medical degrees. They don’t know what they are talking about. All this is rhetoric that the federal government has said…that it causes brain damage, that it causes lung damage, that it causes this and causes that.
What I like to say to people is, “Gee, if that’s really true – explain me!” Before we had a study done the people against us would say about me, “Well, Irvin, you’re the 85-year-old man who smokes three packs of cigarettes a day and says, ‘What do you mean it causes lung cancer? I don’t have it. I’m an anomaly.’”
After the four of us had the testing done. Now when they say, “You’re the only four people in the country that it doesn’t harm but anybody else it would harm.”
But I want to drive under my federal protocol as long as I don’t get an intoxication effect – which I don’t. Now the difference is that people who are cannabis knowledgeable – who get high – they don’t purposely get high and want to drive. They do not. They’re responsible people.
Now if, God forbid, they go somewhere and normally they would smoke half a joint and not get that high and they could drive…all of the sudden they smoke something that gets them really high and they’ve got to drive. Well, guess what? These people all of the sudden realize, “Well, darn, I’m really high. I didn’t want to get that high but I’ve got to drive home.”
Now they know they’re high. That’s a big difference. So when they’re driving they know they have a high. It’s likely they’re going to drive more cautiously and slower. Unlike the person who drinks alcohol and goes, “What do you mean there’s something wrong with me?! I’m fine. I can drive.”
DEAN BECKER: “I’ll fight you for my keys. Give ‘em here!”
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Exactly and that’s what they do. Where the person who’s high on cannabis goes, “Shit, I didn’t mean to get high. Oh my God and I got to drive home. This is not good. But I’ll do it. But I know I’m high.”
That’s the difference. People are more cautious.
DEAN BECKER: I was going to bring up this. The legal marijuana extract that sold- I think it’s made by Merck or Phizer – and it’s a Schedule III which can be prescribed. It’s more readily prescribed these days than ever before. It’s called Marinol – the synthetic THC and they have a warning on the label that says, “Use appropriately until you adjust to its effects.” Be careful with driving or whatever until you get used to the effects.
I think, perhaps, the same could be said of use of any cannabis product.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: First of all it’s by UniMed and is a Schedule III drug. Just like any medicine that we get there’s a label to be careful of about dangerous machinery until you understand the effects of this drug. And that should be with any medicine, including cannabis.
What I laugh about, not laugh, it’s kind of sad is all these commercials we see on TV about all these different drugs that are prescribed and approved by the FDA….every one of them says they can kill you…or it can do this or do that. I mean EVERY one of them. But yet the FDA approved this drug for this use. Even Viagra – if you get an erection for four hours, Oh my God…you know…it’s ridiculous. FDA approves for use but yet it can kill you.
And no one has ever died off cannabis. No one! There’s no lung cancers. If anything it’s an inhibitor against cancer.
DEAN BECKER: The “powers that be” remain near as firmly entrenched as ever, unwilling to debate this issue. And I think there lies the solution – having that final, open debate. Your response.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I would love to get on a podium with my opposition but they will not do it. So that’s a sad aspect. You know, you talk about the detrimental side effects of it and I’d love for them to understand that here I am, a real patient, that I’ve been getting the medicine for 29 years and get to know me.
If you get to know me you’re going to see the fallacies that you believe aren’t true. I’m a very respectful member of society. The sad part of it is how many people in this country are sitting at home because they don’t have the right medicine and they’re not productive members of society. In fact, they’re a drain on society.
Look at the health care issue. We talk about, God forbid, what’s going to happen with health care issues, etc. You know something? Elderly patients could grow this and they would be able to substitute different drugs and use cannabis instead. They wouldn’t have to worry about the interaction of drugs and everything.
So it’s really sad that our country is so paranoid from the pharmaceutical industry and everything else that they won’t even look at this as a potential savior for our medical system and for our patients and also for our economic system.
To put people to work to grow this would be amazing. We’re able to import hemp from Slovakia, Russia, China but we can’t grow it in this country. That doesn’t make any sense to me. We can control pharmaceuticals in this country – we can control this.
The point is even if people are allowed to grow their own – is that the worst thing?! That people are allowed to grow their own medicines instead of spending money on pharmaceuticals?
What always gets me is when people are very sick and they talk about medical cannabis and our opposition says, “Man, it can make you euphoric!” Wait a minute! If you’re sick and you’re not feeling well and you take something that makes you feel better and you feel a little happy – what’s wrong with that?! I just can’t understand that.
Something to our opposition that I always try to state…you know something? Cancer and different diseases, Chrons and different diseases, glaucoma…they don’t know if you’re Republican or Democrat.
Republicans, of all people, talk about states’ rights…states’ rights, states’ rights…except when it comes to drugs - then it’s federal rights. I’m very happy being a federal patient. I don’t have to worry about states’ rights, however, I truly believe that if the feds aren’t going to do anything about it…they had opportunities.
In 1988, Francis Young’s hearings for two years that the DEA had to hold. And Francis Young, a DEA judge, said it is “one of the most benign substances known to mankind and should be made Schedule II or III.” And they ignored him.
The Institute of Medicine report of 1999 which, again, said that medical cannabis should be used until other avenues come up as far as smoking. But smoking for the short term until better comes up. Again, smoking…it can be vaporized, you can make edibles, you can make tinctures – you don’t have to smoke it.
But smoking to me…I’ve been smoking for 40 years and my lungs are perfectly normal. When people talk about it causing lung cancer. Well, gee, Dr. Donald Paskin, the government doctor did a ten year study and at the end of ten years he said he could not find one case of lung cancer due to cannabis.
In fact he said the people who smoked cigarettes and cannabis had less cancer than people who just smoked cigarettes but he wasn’t sure why.
DEAN BECKER: You were talking about states’ rights and I want to bring this up. I think it was last week, perhaps the week before, Senator James Webb had put forward an idea to the senate that let’s investigate the criminal justice system – find the aberrations, fix it up, make it work better for everyone, cut down on the number of prisoners and the number being sent back.
I think it has been rejected. I hear word that perhaps they’re looking at it again. But the objections were all based on, “Oh no, the federal government can’t get involved with that – that’s a states’ rights issue.” And yet, as you were saying, they don’t mind that the federal government deals with the state laws about cannabis.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Very true. James Webb, I think, is from Virginia.
DEAN BECKER: I believe that’s right, yes.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Virginia – the history of our country, “Give me liberty or give me death.” – Patrick Henry. That’s how I was able to take on the federal government when I was in Virginia and I had the state of Virginia behind me.
DEAN BECKER: What a wonderful thing.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: It was then but yet even Virginia today is as backward as a lot of other states. They’ve tried to bring up medical cannabis laws and it’s not gotten anywhere. Although, I want to brag a little bit, I got a law passed in Virginia in 1979. I got Governor Dalton to sign the law and it’s still in effect in Virginia today. It says that a doctor can prescribe (it says prescribe, not recommend) medical marijuana for pain due to cancer and glaucoma.
I was the only patient in Virginia, to my knowledge, that’s ever used it. At that point if I went to the black market – it was a gray area but I wasn’t breaking Virginia law.
DEAN BECKER: That’s amazing.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: That was 1979 and would have ever thought that all these years later we’re still fighting the same issue.
DEAN BECKER: You mentioned 29 years next month that the government has been sending this to you. And, again, it’s grown at the University of Mississippi, approved by the FDA, stamped and certified by the DEA and, as you say, delivered by FedEx, right?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Correct. Grown by NIDA, the National Institute of Drug Abuse, they grow and ship it. And, yeah, approved by FDA, DEA and FedEx ships it.
DEAN BECKER: Oh, 29 years, this also brings to mind…300 joints, about a gram per joint every 29 days – how many pounds has the federal government sent you?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: I figured it out at one time – over 200 pounds.
DEAN BECKER: That’s a lot. That’s a bunch.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yeah, and thank your listeners because your tax money pays for it. I appreciate it.
DEAN BECKER: Alright. Irvin we got just a couple minutes left here and I wanted to hand it over to you and let’s talk, once again, about Patients Out of Time and how folks can learn more and perhaps get involved…perhaps come to the conference next year, right?
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Yes, the conference is April 26-28t h in Tucson, Arizona. We are the medical organization in the United States, in the world for that matter. We are the only ones sanctioned by the American Medical Association, the American Nurses Association to teach doctors and nurses about medical cannabis.
We will have this conference and have the top scientists, doctors, nurses, patients and we want everyone to come out there to learn about medical cannabis. But, more important, to be able to see for themselves the legitimacy of this medicine. That when the federal government states that it’s not a medicine, it’s not real, and we have the top scientist…we have scientists that one day will win the Nobel Medical Prize because what they have discovered as far as the endocannabinoid system that is throughout every person, every animal. We need cannabis in our system. That’s what they’ve discovered. That’s what they’ve learned.
You know people talk about endorphins and they learn about that. But, you know, when people first heard about that – they didn’t know about it either. Medical schools didn’t teach this so it took time and they finally started teaching it and the now the average individual knows about it. Well, guess what? The endorphin system is through the endocannabinoid system.
So we discovered this. For 15 years we know that. We’re teaching it to our doctors, to our nurses. Medical schools aren’t teaching it yet. They will be but we’re ahead of the curve. We’re trying to say, “Come out. Learn about it. Go to our website.” Doctors and nurses can download our previous conferences and get continuing education credits today – it’s there: http://medicalcannabis.com.
Do that. Learn about it and you’ll be in the forefront of modern medicine.
DEAN BECKER: Alright. Irvin Rosenfeld, thank you so much. We’ll be talking to you soon.
IRVIN ROSENFELD: Alright, you take care.
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[music]
DEAN BECKER: To dream…the American dream.
To lie still and hope…with both of your eyes closed.
To ignore…the nightmare that surrounds you.
Just to try…try to reach the American dream.
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[Music intro]
STEWIE GRIFFIN: [Singing] Now everybody gather round and listen if you would, when I tell you every person needs a way of feeling good. Every kitten needs a ball of string and every dog a stick, but all you need is a bag of weed to really get a kick!
CROWD: One two three four five six seven eight! A bag of weed, a bag of weed, everything's better with a bag of weed. It's the only help that you'll ever need, because everything is better with a bag of weed!
STEWIE GRIFFIN: There you go; you're all getting it now!
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DEAN BECKER: It’s an honor. It’s a privilege. It’s a joy. This is the best job I’ve ever had in my life. Thank you for letting me do this. Please show your support for what I do.
There’s no reason for this Drug War to exist. Prohibido istac evilesco!
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For the Drug Truth Network, this is Dean Becker asking you to examine our policy of Drug Prohibition.
The Century of Lies.
This show produced at Pacifica Studios at KPFT, Houston.
Transcript provided by: Jo-D Harrison of www.DrugSense.org